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ramon alban SD1 Regular

Joined: 14 Feb 2006 Posts: 474 Location: Bedford UK
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Posted: Tue Mar 25, 2008 12:26 am Post subject: |
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| chris_derby wrote: |
Should all of the rubber hoses around the plenum all have jubilee clips on them? As a few of them don't, & I've discovered a small split in one of them..... |
Hello Chris, Do the plenum air leak tests to see if you have a problem.
If you want a quick method try squirting plus-gas or wd40 around the suspect hoses to see if it is sucked in. This still wont identify all the possible faults though. Read the article to see why. _________________ Ramon
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chris_derby SD1 Regular

Joined: 04 Sep 2007 Posts: 293 Location: Centre of the universe
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Posted: Fri Mar 28, 2008 9:35 pm Post subject: |
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A thought did occur to me, started the car earlier, & while it was running I removed the wires from the Thermotime switch, which changed nothing, it stil ran like a bag of crap.... _________________ Auto Vitesse, gonna be a beast! |
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Punx0r SD1 Regular
Joined: 05 Nov 2006 Posts: 246
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Posted: Fri Mar 28, 2008 10:28 pm Post subject: |
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If the thermotime switch was stuck closed then the engine would be choked of air at idle when cold, but would run properly once warmed up. |
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chris_derby SD1 Regular

Joined: 04 Sep 2007 Posts: 293 Location: Centre of the universe
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Posted: Fri Mar 28, 2008 10:38 pm Post subject: |
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I see...
I really need somebody local with EFI knowledge to come help me! _________________ Auto Vitesse, gonna be a beast! |
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ramon alban SD1 Regular

Joined: 14 Feb 2006 Posts: 474 Location: Bedford UK
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Posted: Sat Mar 29, 2008 2:00 am Post subject: |
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| chris_derby wrote: | I see...
I really need somebody local with EFI knowledge to come help me! |
You are not gonna believe this but I am actually at the centre of the universe now.
Bring the car around tomorrow and we'll fix it straight away.
Ramon
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Punx0r SD1 Regular
Joined: 05 Nov 2006 Posts: 246
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Posted: Sat Mar 29, 2008 3:50 pm Post subject: |
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Chris, the best thing I can think to do is to go through Ramon's check list of tests in its entirety. It takes a little while but it means you're quite likely to identify any problems with your EFI. If you find nothing then you know your problem is elsewhere and can begin searching there.
I must admit that it did help me a lot with my EFI problems. |
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chris_derby SD1 Regular

Joined: 04 Sep 2007 Posts: 293 Location: Centre of the universe
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Posted: Sun Mar 30, 2008 12:53 pm Post subject: |
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Thanks Ramon, it seems that you are in the next street!
Just found a split hose on the engine, is the hose from the steel pipe or 'air rail' to the overrun valave on the rear or the plenum, not sure what rimmers replacemnt part for this is, but as soon as somebody tells me I will be ordering a new one! Have covered the split in electrical tape for now, which has had the added bonus of me being able to start the ehgine without pumping the throttle like my life depended on it!! No jubilee clips on any of the pipes though, which is slightly worrying!!
I do need a Thermotime switch though, so if anybody has one they would be willing to part with then let me know.... _________________ Auto Vitesse, gonna be a beast! |
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Punx0r SD1 Regular
Joined: 05 Nov 2006 Posts: 246
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Posted: Tue Apr 01, 2008 11:29 pm Post subject: |
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I can't find the over-run valve hose on the Rimmers website - you may have to phone them up and ask for it. It split on my car too so was replaced with a length of generic hose (I think it's coolant), I doubt its effectiveness because it's badly kinked. It may work ok though as it's given no noticable problems.
I think I may have caused confusion earlier - when you mentioned the thermotime switch I was thinking about the auxillary air valve. If memory serves the thermotime switch only controls the cold start injector, which shouldn't be needed in this weather.
Some of the pipes on my engine didn't have clips either, I'm not sure if this is normal, but we added a load to be sure. |
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ramon alban SD1 Regular

Joined: 14 Feb 2006 Posts: 474 Location: Bedford UK
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Posted: Wed Apr 02, 2008 12:06 am Post subject: |
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Bear in mind that the pressure inside the plenum is alway normal or negative never positive (thus they dont blow off) so as long as the hoses fit snugly then they do not need jubilees.
However as they age and go hard, the elasticity of the rubber is lost and they may need a little help from a lightly closed clip - no need to tighten the clips until the hose distorts or you just make new problems.
Regarding the overrun valve the engine will perform perfectly well without it so the valve and the hose could simply be closed off until a suitable replacement is available.
You will only notice the difference on overun with some popping and backfiring in the exhaust - not ideal but - no big deal - plus your fuel consumption will improve as a by-product.
If you visit any motor factor or backstreet garage with your damaged hose you will probably be able to match the diameter and shape from another engine's component and just fettle it to length. Alternatively any Range Rover dealer. What ever you finish up with, it should be able to withstand 10 psi of vacuum without collapsing. _________________ Ramon
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chris_derby SD1 Regular

Joined: 04 Sep 2007 Posts: 293 Location: Centre of the universe
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Posted: Wed Apr 02, 2008 1:45 am Post subject: |
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Thanks for that Ramon. Got another for you, is it normal to hear a sucking noise when the throttle is pressed? Managed to trace the noise to the airflow meter, as the throttle is pressed air is sucked in (I know this is what happens lol!!), but is it normal to make the noise?? _________________ Auto Vitesse, gonna be a beast! |
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ramon alban SD1 Regular

Joined: 14 Feb 2006 Posts: 474 Location: Bedford UK
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Posted: Wed Apr 02, 2008 3:42 am Post subject: |
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If you also experience a loss of power at the same time then maybe you have this:
Sucking sound when depressing loud pedal caused by massive vacuum.
AFM says - need lots of fuel to match all this air entering intake - ECU & injectors respond - at the same time rogue unmetered air also enters plenum thro air leak and because there is no equivalent amount of fuel the overall mixture is now way too weak and the engine cannot function = loss of power.
Solution - fix the air leak.
If there is no loss of power - not too much to worry about
then the noise may simply be the air rushing thro the AFM and kicking up a din due to dirt/obstruction/no air filter/blocked airfilter, what ever.
Ramon
vintagemodelairplane.com |
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chris_derby SD1 Regular

Joined: 04 Sep 2007 Posts: 293 Location: Centre of the universe
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Posted: Mon Apr 07, 2008 10:17 pm Post subject: |
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Ok Ramon, here we go!
Have got some jubilee clips on all of the rubber hoses around the plenum now(not mega tight though!) & have sealed the split hose with plenty of electrical tape.
Still had to pump the pedal a bit to get her fired up, but when she did start the revs went straight up to around the 4000RPM mark & only came down slightly at first, then sort of settled somewhere around 2000RPM.
Any idea what could be causing this? _________________ Auto Vitesse, gonna be a beast! |
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ramon alban SD1 Regular

Joined: 14 Feb 2006 Posts: 474 Location: Bedford UK
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Posted: Mon Apr 07, 2008 10:32 pm Post subject: |
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Yup, too much metered air probably due to
throttle disc being held open by its stop or by crud,
Throttle cable too tight
Cruise control actuator and rod wrongly adjusted
or throttle pedal not returning to closed position
or overrun valve not closed.
or EAV wide open and not closing withy heat
or AFM telling a falsehood about how much air is passing thro'
or from another point of view - ECU broken
Read about idle speed hangup on my website.
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_________________ Ramon
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chris_derby SD1 Regular

Joined: 04 Sep 2007 Posts: 293 Location: Centre of the universe
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Posted: Mon Apr 07, 2008 10:42 pm Post subject: |
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So you think I should get another ECU? It just seems odd, that before I put jubilee clips on the air hoses, the engine would idle at low revs, & then stall....
I messed about with the idle screw(no change either way) and the mixture adjustment but that didn't help.
I will check the throttle cable tomorrow, but I have never noticed it was too tight before. I could also put my old AFM back on to see if that does anything, although I took the old one off as the cover was loose. Have not checked the EAV, will try to obtain a replacement at the Spares Day, and maybe a replacement overrun valve too, or is it possible to clean up the existing valve if a repolacement is not available? _________________ Auto Vitesse, gonna be a beast! |
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ramon alban SD1 Regular

Joined: 14 Feb 2006 Posts: 474 Location: Bedford UK
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Posted: Tue Apr 08, 2008 1:26 am Post subject: |
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| chris_derby wrote: | So you think I should get another ECU?
That's not really what I said, they are known to go wrong and as you asked for ideas thats what you are getting - ideas , not actualities.
Having a spare ECU to try is an advantage but after all the easier, cheaper options are eliminated.
It just seems odd, that before I put jubilee clips on the air hoses, the engine would idle at low revs, & then stall....
Not really odd because you have changed the situation by fixing some faults and the mixture is now more under control, its just that the idle rpm is now too high, so there are still faults to find and the symptoms are now different - I call that significant progress.
I messed about with the idle screw (no change either way)
The idle screw is for small adjustments at normal idle rpm - your current idle is too high for other reasons.
Never the less it could also mean that the idle air gallery is blocked and the car cannot run properly until that is investigated and resolved.
Perhaps you did this already, if so forget this suggestion.
And the mixture adjustment but that didn't help.
Similar reasons as above, but this only has an effect on CO emissions at normal idle speed.
Both these galleries are quite small so can be insignificant compared to some fault conditions
I will check the throttle cable tomorrow, but I have never noticed it was too tight before.
Tight is not necessarily the issue, but maladjustment may prevent the throttle from fully closing as can a maladjusted throttle stop (if you have one - not everyone has)
High friction in the throttle shaft assy and throttle disc is very common
I could also put my old AFM back on to see if that does anything, although I took the old one off as the cover was loose.
Def worth a try.
Have not checked the EAV, will try to obtain a replacement at the Spares Day,
Why? - you need to check the function and connections first - suggest you read the article on EAV again.
and maybe a replacement overrun valve too, or is it possible to clean up the existing valve if a repolacement is not available?
It's bulletproof but can get jammed with debris - see item 7 page 5 plenum article.
Also item 13 page 4 of my test and adjustment program
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Comment - are we covering the same ground over and over or does it just seem like de jas vu all over again?
Keep the faith - re-read all the stuff and carry out the tests as recommended in the articles. _________________ Ramon
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